Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

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Valjuen
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Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Valjuen »

Hi, everyone. I'm new to this site, but me and my cousin have been camping Ranger-esque for a couple of years.
But, seeing as we were really young, we didn't really do it authentically.

I'm restarting my Ranger gear, though still keeping some older things (a tunic I made with my grandmother, I'll post an image later; a recurve bow I bought a while ago, works really well).
But, as I'm from Australia, leather is really hard to come by, and when you do, it's not cheap.
And thus, I have to resort to fake leather.

Are there any tips on how to make fake leather look really good?

Thanks for any suggestions

Sincerely, Valjuen
As dead flies cause the perfumer’s oil to stink and bubble, so a little foolishness outweighs wisdom and glory. - Ecc 10:1
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Peter Remling
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Peter Remling »

Hi and Welcome

A quick answer: No fake leather will not look or hold up like real leather.

What are you looking to do with the leather ? If it's for footwear, scabbards, sheathes or carrying cases : packs, pouches etc, fine. Clothing is actually too hot, retains sweat/smell and doesn't breath as well as other choices.

Leather prices have gone up a great deal in the past 10 years. Ten years ago I'd buy whole hides for $ 40-50 US regularly, now it's almost 2x that.
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Taurinor
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Taurinor »

Peter Remling wrote:A quick answer: No fake leather will not look or hold up like real leather.
What he said.

There are different "grades" of fake leather, with some that look like something you'd make a rain slicker out of rather than something that came from an animal, and some that are reasonably colored with a matte finish that have a faux-grain pattern stamped on them. Like Peter said, though, none will hold up like real leather, and even the nice ones will lose the illusion of being leather after a little wear. The nice ones also have prices approaching that of real leather, only you can buy them by the yard instead of the square foot.

One thing you could do to get small pieces of leather for pouches or other small projects is to look at op shops/thift stores/charity shops. You can sometimes find leather jackets and purses that can be taken apart for raw materials. Just make sure to check the tags to make sure they are real leather when you start out - like I said, there are some good synthetics out there that can fool you when you first start looking. Some smaller purses can even be used as belt pouches with minimal modification, if they don't have zippers or other obviously modern hardware - just take off the straps and attach belt loops!
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Udwin
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Udwin »

First off: welcome! I got into hobbit hiking when I was about your age, and believe me, we were far from authentic! We all have to start somewhere.
When new folks show up, it always pays to bring up the designer's paradox diagram:
Image

Second: what they said ^.
What items of your gear is this leather intended for? If it's for clothing (jerkins or the like), it would be best to put it out of your mind: garments made of true grain leather are (with a few exceptions) essentially modern Hollywoodisms. Buckskin/braintan is more appropriate for clothing (since it actually breathes), but as it cannot be produced on a mass scale, it remains expen$ive.
You can easily put together a fine kit using a minimum of leather, however, if you opt instead for linen or wool for garments, packs, drawstring bags, etc. As Taurinor suggested, get familiar with your local secondhand shop and keep your eye out for 100% linen or wool items (plus-size clothing is a great source for fabric) and true leathergoods to cannibalize.
If there's one item of your kit that needs to be real leather, it's your footwear. If you aren't going to craft your own, you may have to save up a bit for proper leather shoes, but it will be worth it.

Third: I'm not sure how things work Down Under, but do you have hunters in Australia? If you want to learn [giant airquotes] "Ranger" skills, your most authentic and rewarding option would be to learn how to create your own leather - either barktan or braintan. The main difficulty would be obtaining raw hides, and if you don't have access to hunted hides, how about getting in touch with your local butcher? They usually sell them to fertilizer companies, and might be persuaded to 'donate' a hide or two to a young up-and-coming tanner ; )
Barring that route, you Do have roads in Australia, yes? I don't know how smart kangaroos are, but if they're anything like our fourlegged local critters, there's always roadkill. I get about half of my deerskins from the local roadways in the fall/winter.
Personae: Aistan son of Ansteig, common Beorning of Wilderland; Tungo Brandybuck, Eastfarthing Bounder, 3018 TA; a native Man of the Greyflood, c.850 SA
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Elleth
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Elleth »

Several things.

First, I totally understand we all have to make allowances for reality. Moreover, practicing on cheap materials is a great way to get started and learn crafting techniques. Better to trash a couple square feet of cheap fake stuff than the same amount of nice tooling leather. So while it's nothing you want in your kit long term, I think it's a reasonable on-ramp to the hobby if it's all you can get ahold of.

Next - as Peter says, it really depends what application you're talking about: vinyl-like fake leathers don't breathe at all and will be horrible if you try to wear them - even as boots I'd say. For things like pouches and quivers and such, it will never look as nice no matter what you do, but it won't be painful to use. You might try sanding the surface a bit and rubbing it down with mineral oil: I can't guarantee that will work, but if you already have some and really don't like the surface it's worth a try. (test on a little piece of scrap first, of course)

Finally - if you want a deeper sense of authenticity, I'd say do exactly what our forefathers did when leather was expensive (and it was!) - use textiles instead.
Ursus in fact recently ditched his leather quiver for one of linen:
http://middleearthrangers.org/forum/vie ... =27&t=3148

.. there's no reason you couldn't use the same for pouches, knapsack/snapsacks, and any other kind of carriage you need. In the medieval era, textile belts were quite common as well. So there's not much leather you actually need for a really good, deeply authentic impression.

Finally, remember that in the real world most indigenous cultures that used animal skins in daily clothing ditched them as soon as they could get textiles through trade. There's a reason for that. Leather looks nice, but it's really not great for most clothing applications.
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Valjuen
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Valjuen »

With fake leather, at least here anyway, there's a white part underneath the leather. I don't have a problem with making the actual leather look good, it's just the part underneath it.
Would you recommend I just sew another piece of leather underneath it?
As dead flies cause the perfumer’s oil to stink and bubble, so a little foolishness outweighs wisdom and glory. - Ecc 10:1
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Peter Remling
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Peter Remling »

The white part underneath is a fabric base that the vinyl fake leather is adhered to. No part of it is actual leather. You can still use it to create a pattern but I wouldn't recommend wearing a garment of it.
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Valjuen »

This post has a couple of images
Attachments
Here's another look at the tunic and a better look at the recurve bow
Here's another look at the tunic and a better look at the recurve bow
IMG_7523.jpg (154.39 KiB) Viewed 14545 times
Here's the tunic I made a year and a half ago
Here's the tunic I made a year and a half ago
IMG_7558.JPG (91.84 KiB) Viewed 14545 times
As dead flies cause the perfumer’s oil to stink and bubble, so a little foolishness outweighs wisdom and glory. - Ecc 10:1
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Kortoso »

I didn't know about the lack of leather in Australia. I covered a sword scabbard with what I was told was kangaroo hide. Maybe it was not really kangaroo hide, but it would do very well for what you have in mind.
I can't see making boots with fake leather, certainly not something for real use, maybe cosplay at a convention.

Looks like those boots are mostly leather, and you are "dressing them up" with fake leather at the top? That might work - until you slay your first boomer. :P
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Taurinor
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Taurinor »

Valjuen wrote:With fake leather, at least here anyway, there's a white part underneath the leather. I don't have a problem with making the actual leather look good, it's just the part underneath it.
Peter Remling wrote:The white part underneath is a fabric base that the vinyl fake leather is adhered to. No part of it is actual leather.
It may be more straightforward to refer to artifical stuff as "naugahyde" or "pleather", so everyone knows which material is being discussed.
Valjuen wrote:Would you recommend I just sew another piece of leather underneath it?
You could potentially do that, but if expense is an issue, lining it with a similarly colored cotton might be a cheaper route. However...
Peter Remling wrote:You can still use it to create a pattern but I wouldn't recommend wearing a garment of it.
I really have to side with Pete on this, and urge you to reconsider naugahyde as a garment material. It's not authentic and it wears poorly, but most importantly, it would be just plain dangerous to wear in the woods. A garment made of it will not allow sweat to evaporate, which could result in heat exhaustion during exertion. That same sweat, trapped against the body at night, could result in hypothermia. Naugahyde is also made out of plastic, effectively, and can melt if it comes in contact with a spark or flame. This may result the melted material adhering to skin and resulting in severe burns. Accessories like pouches, bracers, etc. (if that's what you're looking to make from naugahyde) don't need to be breathable, but the melting issue is still a possible concern.

I promise that I'm not trying to be alarmist, but while doing what we aim to do on this forum, the wrong fabric choices for your clothing can (at worst) kill you or (less seriously) make your woods excursion uncomfortable and not as much fun as we all want it to be for you.

Okay, PSA done! On to the gear pics you put up!

First off, that's a good looking bow! Recurves are definitely easier to handle in the woods, at least in my experience.

I understand that your tunic may have sentimental value, since you made if with your grandmother, but it seems a little short. Historically speaking, tunics were typically longer - mid-thigh or knee length are usually safe bets. That's not a hard and fast rule, of course; the cotehardies of the late 14th century became very short, to the point that joined hose became a necessity. They evolved into the doublets and arming jackets of the 15th century.

For a standard tunic, though, you can't go wrong with with a simple knee-length T-tunic:
Image
Image found here.

There were some stylistic changes over the centuries, but people were wearing something along those lines from Rome, till the 14th/15th century - over 1000 years! That pattern is not the most historically accurate version, but it's very simple to put together.

Like I said before, I understand if there is some sentimental value to the tunic, though, so another option for adding length would be to wear a surcoat/surcote/tabard over it:
Image
Image found here.

A surcoat can be a simple as a rectangle of cloth with a hole in it for your head, sewn closed on the side from your armpits to your waist. Some people even leave the sides open and close the surcoat with a belt, but I find that my sword hilt gets stuck inside when the sides are left open.

Are the boots costume/casual wear boots or something with a solid sole? I can tell from the picture, but make sure you have footwear that is kind to your feet and sturdy enough to hold up. Authenticity takes a back seat to physical comfort, especially when feet are concerned!
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Valjuen
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Valjuen »

Peter Remling wrote:I wouldn't recommend wearing a garment of it.
I wasn't going to make a garment of it, but I was just going to use it for pouches and a quiver.
As dead flies cause the perfumer’s oil to stink and bubble, so a little foolishness outweighs wisdom and glory. - Ecc 10:1
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Peter Remling »

It will work for both and you'll learn some skills you can take with you at a later time when you have the opportunity to work with leather.
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Taurinor
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Taurinor »

Valjuen wrote:I wasn't going to make a garment of it, but I was just going to use it for pouches and a quiver.
Do you know what thread you plan on using? I would avoid artificial sinew with naugahyde - that stuff can cut through thinner real leather; I'd imagine it would slice vinyl similarly.

Will you be machine sewing or hand-stitching? A lot of home sewing machines have a hard time getting through multiple layers of naugahyde, so you may want to use an awl and hand-sew, like you would leather.
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Elleth »

Sounds like it'll do fine for pouches and quiver. :)

The pouch I agree you might want to try lining with fabric to cover the inner weave - I don't think that would work for the quiver, since the arrows would quickly shred a lining. Two layers on naugahyde back to back would probably work just fine though - I know Greg has talked about his quiver being two layers of leather sewn back to back.

For what it's worth: I think at the price point you're talking you'll have a better result you'll be happier with for longer making a canvas arrow bag like the one Ursus made.
HOWEVER I also totally get having your eye on something, and nothing but that thing will do. And it's great practice for when you can afford to make a leather one: so good luck!


RE: The tunic. I was thinking Link. :)
I also like Urthgard's yes - he has a good eye!
I think he mostly used the Nockert pattern, which caedmon has written up here:

http://middleearthrangers.org/forum/vie ... 29&p=35805

Adding a collar is a little tricky, but I'm sure your grandmother can help you - mandarin collars were all the rage once upon a time, so she's almost certainly done it before.

If you do sew by hand, this is a good place to start:
http://rosaliegilbert.com/sewingtechniques.html

And finally, if at all possible use linen or wool rather than cotton, especially if you'll be out in the weather in it.
(Wool dyes MUCH easier than linen, for what it's worth - but if you're hand sewing linen is much easier to work with than wool )

Once upon a time getting linen was easier said than done, but these days linen fabric is surprisingly cheap and easy to find - at least here in the US. I'd think you could still find it in Australia.
If you don't know right off where to look, give LeLoup a holler, and he can probably point you to a local vendor:
He doesn't come around this forum very much anymore (so email is probably better) - but he does lots of 18th c. stuff:

https://woodsrunnersdiary.blogspot.com/
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Re: Any ways on how to make fake leather look real?

Post by Kortoso »

Early days, lad. It looks like you're young and your bankroll is not limitless. I'd advise doing what you can, and afford now. Test it out in the field (which is what we are about rather than sci-fi conventions for the most part), and continue to learn and modify. You'll do fine.
There are no safe paths in this part of the world. Remember you are over the Edge of the Wild now, and in for all sorts of fun wherever you go.
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