Thoughts...?

Western(esse) Martial Arts / Numenorean Martial Arts....

Combat and self-defense in Middle-earth

Moderators: Eric C, Greg

User avatar
Ursus
Amrod Rhandir
Posts: 538
Joined: Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:31 pm
Location: Illinois

Re: Thoughts...?

Post by Ursus »

Quick update. I'm blazing a trail on the typed portion of the class and the descriptions that go with each demo picture but the weather has been foul and has prevented us from getting out and getting the shots I need. I'm still shooting for early May but being a something of a martial perfectionist wont deliver until I'm satisfied I've done all I can do. The content stands at sword and buckler and single sword. Sword and Buckler is a combo of I.33 and Talhoffer. The single sword portion is going to be an amalgam of Marozzo's work on single sword, some of Talhoffers messer work, a bit of George Silvers thoughts and some of my own adaptations. Most of the display will be done with a Windlass Type XIV on my end just to give folks and idea of the sword size I'll be using. I prefer a shorter sword for this type of work but any length of single hander will do nicely.

Bear with me on the time table if it changes. This is my first venture into virtual teaching and Im finding it difficult. Combat is my passion and my problem is that I'm very expressive and hands on. In classes I'm used to freezing two people sparring mid fight and wrenching and maneuvering them around to get the body mechanics right or diving in and displaying personally. In the next round I may scrap doing full write ups and go video for some the displays and pictures for some of the necessary freeze frames.
"Lonely men are we, Rangers of the wild, hunters – but hunters ever of the servants of the Enemy."

“My cuts, short or long, don’t go wrong.”
User avatar
Greg
Urush bithî 'nKi ya-nam bawâb
Posts: 4496
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:50 pm
Location: Eriador; Central Indiana

Re: Thoughts...?

Post by Greg »

Stoked.
Now the sword shall come from under the cloak.
User avatar
Ursus
Amrod Rhandir
Posts: 538
Joined: Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:31 pm
Location: Illinois

Re: Thoughts...?

Post by Ursus »

Side note. A lot of the single sword will be very simple and brutally effective work. Moves that I find to be easy to execute in the confines of the trees and confines of the forest to help nullify an opponent in that setting. The sword and buckler will be cut and dry HEMA but the single sword is tailored specifically for the ranger, maybe we should coin the term RHEMA?
"Lonely men are we, Rangers of the wild, hunters – but hunters ever of the servants of the Enemy."

“My cuts, short or long, don’t go wrong.”
User avatar
Greg
Urush bithî 'nKi ya-nam bawâb
Posts: 4496
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:50 pm
Location: Eriador; Central Indiana

Re: Thoughts...?

Post by Greg »

I dig it. Jack's also coined "NMA" in the forum title, which is nifty, too...but this wandering period is too far removed to be considered Numenorean in art, so RHEMA could be a fun buzzword.
Now the sword shall come from under the cloak.
User avatar
Manveruon
Thangailhir
Posts: 2582
Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2011 6:11 am
Location: Littleton, CO
Contact:

Re: Thoughts...?

Post by Manveruon »

I can't express how excited I am about this idea. Everything you've described so far sounds EXACTLY like what I've been wanting to learn for years now.

Ursus wrote:Bear with me on the time table if it changes. This is my first venture into virtual teaching and Im finding it difficult. Combat is my passion and my problem is that I'm very expressive and hands on. In classes I'm used to freezing two people sparring mid fight and wrenching and maneuvering them around to get the body mechanics right or diving in and displaying personally. In the next round I may scrap doing full write ups and go video for some the displays and pictures for some of the necessary freeze frames.
I would personally love to see some video to supplement your text and pictures. I think it would make for a more organic teach process as well.
Ursus wrote:Side note. A lot of the single sword will be very simple and brutally effective work. Moves that I find to be easy to execute in the confines of the trees and confines of the forest to help nullify an opponent in that setting. The sword and buckler will be cut and dry HEMA but the single sword is tailored specifically for the ranger, maybe we should coin the term RHEMA?
This part, especially, has me extremely excited. Give me functional, effective, and efficient, by all means. I love the fact that you're combining different sources for a tailor-made result geared specifically towards the kind of close-quarters, woodland fighting a ranger would be most likely to engage in.

In short, I can't wait! Thanks again!
Maerondir Perianseron, also called “Mickel,” Halfling Friend - Ranger of the Misty Mountains
User avatar
robinhoodsghost
Silent Watcher over the Peaceful Lands
Posts: 337
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2012 2:04 pm
Location: Kentucky

Re: Thoughts...?

Post by robinhoodsghost »

Thanks for the time and effort you are putting into this Ranger Ursus. I could see this virtual teaching, expand into other areas in the near future.
In the darkest part of Sherwoods glade, in the thickest part of the wood, there are those who say, can still be seen, the ghost of Robin Hood.
User avatar
Ursus
Amrod Rhandir
Posts: 538
Joined: Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:31 pm
Location: Illinois

Re: Thoughts...?

Post by Ursus »

So quick update here. As we all know I'm well behind my target launch date for this project. The good new is that I'm still working on it and am really liking what is taking shape albeit slowly. The not so goodish news is that I've decided to forgo a separate sword and buckler section in favor of focusing on more ranger specific combat ventures. To that end I would like to introduce what I'm calling ROHEMA. Ranger Oriented Historical European Martial Arts. In summary I am taking and applying many of the concepts, movements and philosophies of HEMA/WMA and tailoring them to the ranger lifestyle. What exactly does that mean? It means focusing on the systematic use of weapons and weapon combinations specific to the ranger, both canon and non yet all historical and systematically viable. It means getting in the environment to display and teach combat and tactical scenarios applicable to a man often alone and outnumbered in the wild. This will not be another set of standard drills taught on flat even ground that a ranger will seldom fight on, though there will be some of that mixed in at the beginning of each new topic before we head to the wooded areas. In the end this is going to be so much more than just the handling of weapons. I know many seem to gasp at this word here, but it is going to involve a lot of tactical thinking, but not in a modern spec op sense. Among others we are going to be showing how to apply each weapon while fighting on good ground of your choosing or how to make the best of bad ground in bad situations etc. There will be one on one but I will also be handling multiple opponents as well, because I believe a ranger will seldom be involved in a fair one on one fight. Most important is this. I want you, the forum member to be involved in the shaping of this new martial philosophy. Let me know what you would like to see used or if there is a scenario you have in mind or if you would like to get involved somehow, anything at all please let me know. The biggest thing I will stress is to keep it realistic and practical. No Viggo at Amon Hen stuff please.
Last edited by Ursus on Mon Jul 18, 2016 4:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
"Lonely men are we, Rangers of the wild, hunters – but hunters ever of the servants of the Enemy."

“My cuts, short or long, don’t go wrong.”
User avatar
mcapanelli
Haeropada
Posts: 757
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 1:48 pm
Location: New York, New York
Contact:

Re: Thoughts...?

Post by mcapanelli »

So, since they'll be no sword and buckler classes, I'd like to offer to anyone interested, the primer video we use in my class. If you'd like it, shoot me a PM. I also have some longsword stuff as well.
Winter is coming
User avatar
Ursus
Amrod Rhandir
Posts: 538
Joined: Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:31 pm
Location: Illinois

Re: Thoughts...?

Post by Ursus »

mcapanelli wrote:So, since they'll be no sword and buckler classes, I'd like to offer to anyone interested, the primer video we use in my class. If you'd like it, shoot me a PM. I also have some longsword stuff as well.

Sword and buckler isn't nessecarily out I just currently do not plan to do the class in the context I originally intended, which is to say cut and dry I:33. I still plan on covering it, just in a ROHEMA sense which hybrids several different sources together and places it in the woodland setting they would be applied to. If you'd like to contribute some of your groups research and thoughts to the project that'd be great though. The more the merrier!
"Lonely men are we, Rangers of the wild, hunters – but hunters ever of the servants of the Enemy."

“My cuts, short or long, don’t go wrong.”
User avatar
Harper
Haeropada
Posts: 793
Joined: Thu Dec 31, 2015 7:11 pm

Re: Thoughts...?

Post by Harper »

I'm looking forward to this. Even though I recently purchased a buckler, I think that this new approach is more appropriate. I know it won the poll, but I just didn't see it for Rangering--I sitll would have enjoyed it though.

As far as canon versus non-canon teachings, I personally don't think that that's an issue. There are only so many ways to cut, stick or bludgeon a humanoid. Certainly, there are stylistic differences with respect to: armor, environment, etc. I never did fully understand why some of the purists insist upon documented sources--especially in a fantasy milieu. They are designed to teach the basics. Once you own the basics, they are yours. You then make your own "style" based on what you have learned in conjunction with your reach, age, etc. For example, somebody taught Mozart to read music. What he did afterwards was uniquely his. Nobody remembers his teacher.

As far as what I would like to see emphasized (aside from a bow, which I assume would be a Ranger's primary weapon) would be what I would likely carry in a wilderness: short sword, axe/hawk and a large knife in both one and, especially, two handed applications. After that, a spear. Yes, I know Aragorn didn't carry these things in the main text of LOTR. But, Narsil was essentially a short sword for the bulk of his wanderings and it was more than just a sword to him. It is reasonable to assume that Aragorn would have learned to master the bow during his fostering in Imladris. Axes/hawks and large knives would have been part of everday life in a wilderness setting and even common people would have known how to use them as weapons. Ranger's certainly would have. Since we know that Aragorn had had a horse, Roheryn, and rode with the Rohirrim, he almost certainly would have known how to use a spear both mounted and dismounted.

I think ROHEMA is a good concept.
Post Reply