Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

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Eledhwen
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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby Eledhwen » Mon Sep 06, 2010 1:20 am

Huh. Interesting. The blades are too slender for my tastes, but they are interesting. Thanks!

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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby Ernildir » Mon Sep 06, 2010 2:32 am

Thanks for the sheath pic.

I actually just finished reading the eight Ranger's Apprentice book, and I was watching for double-knife details this time. At one point, one of the Rangers actually "unclips" his throwing knife scabbard from the arrangement on his waist (I don't quite remember why, I think he might have wanted to hide his knife in his sleeve or something similar). So the double-knife scabbard as depicted in the series, it would seem, is not actually a single scabbard which holds two knives, but two scabbards arranged on the waist under the off-hand.
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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby Eledhwen » Mon Sep 06, 2010 11:04 am

Or the two sheaths are clipped together and can be separated, which is intriguing.

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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby D4nnyR4ng3rB0y » Fri May 27, 2011 9:57 pm

I actually have someone near by who can do I don't know how much but he's a friend so I know he'll work hard on it and I think it'll turn out well I'll post pictures as soon as I can and for those who don't know they have bows in real life that are like the bow Will has in the sorcerer from the north it's simply called a take down recurve I have one and I am hoping to develop their bow, throwing knife, and saxe skill in short time
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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby R.D.Metcalf » Wed Jun 01, 2011 6:47 pm

I do like watching this kind of project unfold 8) This will be awesome in steel.
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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby Rangerguy9 » Wed Jun 01, 2011 10:57 pm

:D
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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby Rangerguy9 » Wed Jun 01, 2011 10:58 pm

so were talking about weapons? :?
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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby R.D.Metcalf » Thu Jun 02, 2011 10:25 pm

Eric C wrote:Okay guys, I'm keeping an eye on this thread too for research purposes. Some good suggestions here. Up to this point all of my blades have been made from 3/16" or less sawblade steel. But I have been thinking about some projects that I have on tap- both orders and personal ideas that I will offer for sale- and they will need some thicker steel, say 1/4." I'm thinking 1095, or 5160 for this project and others that I made mention of.

Anyway, once Ernildhir and I work out some details and I get the steel ordered, I'll be ready to start. This may be a challenge. Good, I like challenges. :twisted:

Anyway, once we come to a conclusion as to how the respective knives should look, I'll be ready to go.
The frontier moves with the sun and pushes the Red Man of these wilderness forests in front of it... until one day there will be nowhere left. Then our race will be no more, or be not us.

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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby Ringulf » Wed Jul 27, 2011 4:08 am

OK folks I don't know how I missed this thread as I was reading everything I could when I first jumped on the site! kinda strange having come from the Rangers Apprentice community so to speak!

It seems like you have had the same questions regarding Mr Flannagan's concept of the knives and the double sheath that we did.

I actually have correspondance I am sending to Mr. Flannagan from Halt's Playground (the RA RPG site that Brandwyn and I write on) asking about this question. We have a writer on the site who is in Australia and said that John is very accomodating and will answer his fans questions whenever possible. so keep your fingers crossed and I will try to keep you posted for the official word.

As a reasonable attempt to solidify this info, I will share what we have come up with so far.

At first I thought that these blades were kept in a "kangaroo" type sheath as was suggested by the picture of the two daggers together sent by Willrett. That style made sense to me and having been familiar with Aragorn's ranger sword and knife combo so the picture was firm in my mind. Then the same questions of draw and carry and all as described in the books came up.

Some issues popped up about righty/lefty configuration and why the kangaroo style would mean two different sheaths would need to be built (not practical for General issue ordinance) then also the double draw being somewhat more difficult (though the way you described the draw was perfect Belbarad.) and the fact that the thrower can be quick drawn and thrown in one smooth motion as explained in the books. All this got me thinking about the sheath being one on top of the other vertically, in line so to speak, and then I found these pictures that are on the covers of the Australian edditions to the books.

Image

Image

Image

Now I realize having done some book covers myself, that cover illustrations are not always very factual and that many artists never even read the books they design for, so I am not using this as difinitive research or imperical evidence just saying if the guy drew it on three different covers and that there are several of the Halt's peril covers that don't have the rig on Halt's belt at all (so they must have felt it important enough to put in later) at least they seem to be thinking about it.

It has been my intention to make a prototype for what I felt was the Araluen Ranger Corps knife combo and sheath so I have several stainless blanks to work with. That project was postponed in order to explore the Cold Steel project. I ordered 3, 10" seax machetes and 2 of the 18" (I have always wanted to fight flourentine langseax and when I got a glimpse of the new Fili I knew I had to do it before the movie comes out or be labled a rogue!)

The 10 inch seax is about what he describes and though I initially invisioned it to be of the "broke back" style, there is the line in the book that said that the Ranger seax was "based" on the Skandian seax but was far better made by the smiths of Araluen allowing them to be made stronger, better (lighter, thinner?).
Looking at the cold steel I saw the sheepsfoot blade and the thin spring steel to be that quality improvement.

I also felt that at the price and availability of the cs piece modification would be less costly and therefore within the reach of most folks who would love to have a standard issue, almost surplus, blade set.

I will be cutting the leather rings for the handle, and looking for the best brass crossguard and butt cap for it. If you folks have any suggestions chime in.

I saw the Track of the wolf and Townsend sites for blackpowder reinactors and the ones on Ragnar's site, and perhaps something there will work. otherwise I am moving along with the other threads that explain more of this.

The thrower I veiwed as more of the 10" oa thowers that were popular in the 70's that had the diamond point and the ring in the back (not that I think it would have a ring just that the shape was sugestive of the type he describes) but then the leaf shape thing came up so I think the cold steel thrower here, will be what I pair the seax up with. I think they will make a nice set.

Image

This one will get the same leather ring handle (just like the old K Bar's) and a matching but hopefully smaller, brass, butt cap and cross guard, without altering her throwing qualities badly.

Let me know what you think, it sounds like enough of you are interested and I have had several inquiries from RA people so this has become a priority project for me.

So it seems that if the forged version is being considered, it will be a much nicer piece than this but this could serve most of the prospective customers within a lower price range. :mrgreen:
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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby Willrett » Wed Jul 27, 2011 12:04 pm

Great ideas cant wait to see finished pics. I think this series is going to get a reread here very soon so I can take some notes.
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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby Ringulf » Wed Jul 27, 2011 12:48 pm

There is also a heck of a lot of good information and many stories on the RPG site we are on. If you enjoy doing some writing yourself or you feel like you might like to read some other "side" stories based on Flannagans works, feel free to jump on and check it out. The forum on HP is the same proboard format so you should be used to Navigating it. You can come and read anytime or make a character (or several) and jump into some plotline!

The link for anyone interested is: Halt's Playground

http://araluenrpg.proboards.com/index.cgi

We would love to have some new Rangers and are particularly a bit shy of more experienced ranger/mentor types.

We get alot of young people who love the books but are not yet learned in the ranger ways, so here is a great chance to teach some of the fantastic knowledge MERF has exibited to me, and get some more interest coming back to this site too!
A heartening sight by Day or Night, Dwarven warriors bold! To add their Might to any Fight, Precious more than Gold! A Dwarven friend is to the end, Never shall they fail! Their word does not bend, wherever they wend,
through Cavern, Hill or Dale!"
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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby Ernildir » Wed Jul 27, 2011 5:29 pm

Thanks for the post, Ringulf. The "forged version" that Eric C and I were considering together didn't end up happening (although I'm thinking I might approach him about it again in a few years :lol: ), but this "standard issue" modified set sounds very interesting. There is a good chance I would be interested in purchasing a set from you once I see pictures and hear about how awesome they are. ;)

Anyway, as far as the sheath discussion goes... I remember reading in one of the books (8 or 9 I think) that for some reason at one point one of the Rangers detached one of his knife sheaths from the arrangement. I don't remember why he did it, but he did. So however the sheaths are arranged, they ought to be detachable from one another.
And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby Ernildir » Wed Jul 27, 2011 5:34 pm

Oh, and another thing to consider... the Rangers' seaxes, as well as their throwing knives, were throwable in the series. I was paying attention to this over the last few books, and they are actually throwing around their seaxes just about as often as their throwing knives. Something to think about. I don't know how easy it would be to obtain/forge a "throwing seax."
And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby Ringulf » Wed Jul 27, 2011 5:59 pm

As far as the sheath goes I could make that happen rather easily looking at the suggested arrangement on the artists pictures on the Australian editions just need to make two wooden cores or even easier two thicker leather pocket type sheaths and have two grometed flanges one upper one lower between the two. Most likely part of the leather outer skin. That would be tough and less costly, making it easier to produce. (not that I mind the time or effort but I am trying to think as the designer of a limited production quasi military ordinace mass produced by a medeival government)

As far as throwing them this is a good support for using the broken back configuration as it seems to stick a tiny bit better, but the sheeps foot works not to much worse. The thicker spine might give a bit more heft whem throwing too.

I still think The GI version is gonna stay sheeps foot as it is the exeption to throw the thing rather than the rule as the thrower is there.
A heartening sight by Day or Night, Dwarven warriors bold! To add their Might to any Fight, Precious more than Gold! A Dwarven friend is to the end, Never shall they fail! Their word does not bend, wherever they wend,
through Cavern, Hill or Dale!"
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Re: Ranger's Apprentice Style Saxe Knife and Throwing Knife

Postby Greg » Thu Jul 28, 2011 8:08 am

Any blade can be thrown. Throwing knives as a rule, are simply designed with the action in mind, but any knife, fincluding my bowie-bladed 1960's ka-bar can be thrown. Blades don't have to balance in the middle to be good throwers. They'll be a little less effective if they are handle-heavy, but anything balanced from the center on out will throw nicely. The balance point only decides where it rotates, and which end will "want" to go forward...but even a lightweight, poorly balanced kitchen knife can be successfully thrown. I'd racommend not owrrying about designing the seax around throwing, but rather design the seax around function and then learn how to throw it as is.
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