Opinions on this weapon of the Dwarves

[Andy M]

From Part III, Of Durin's Folk, of Appendix A in The Return of the King;

During the Battle of Azanulbizar at what became known as the Dimrill Dale;

“Coming late and fresh to the field the mailed warriors of Nain, Gror's son, drove through the orcs to the very threshold of Moria, crying “Azog! Azog!" as they hewed down with their mattocks all who stood in their way.“
“Soon Nain made a great stoke with all his strength that remained, but Azog darted aside and kicked Nain's leg, so that the mattock splintered on the stone where he had stood, but Nain stumbled forward."

For years I had assumed for some reason that the mattocks was the big wooden mallet I used to picture Dwarves carrying. Looking into it though they appear to be the miner's tool which would make since for the Dwarves.

Anyone familiar with these? Was a variant ever used as a weapon?

Andy

[Greg]

I could see the pick end of one being used as a two-handed war hammer.

All the same, my google image search for mattock revealed a photo of a man with a gardening hoe in martial arts dress. Intrigued, I read on to learn that 18th-19th century Japanese commoners used them as weapons. I could totally see dwarves doing this, too.

Details here.

[caedmon]

Mattocks are a pick axe with the blade rotated 90 degrees. They are great for digging, and were around in the Middle Ages. I'm sure they were used as impromptu / lower class weapons.

Think war adze with a spike on the back. Perfect dual duty implement for Dwarves.

[Steven S.]

I originally thought the same... a large iron bound wooden mallet.. but i think the other interpretation is more plausible. Given the fact that they are a mining tool, and knowing what they can do to turf (probably not the intended use ) I can imagine dwarves using them and the damage they could inflict.

[Beornmann]

A local WMA friend has been studying the entrenching tool as a weapon, ala WWI trench warfare. I’ll ask him for some sources. By the way he also studies Carpathian walking axe, which somewhat relates to the mattocks or other improvised weapons.

Try searching "mattock as a weapon" to get better results, removing many gardening sites. Also browsed around with pick-axe, adze, and the Pulaski axe, which I have always thought as wicked looking. Mostly the mattock, picks, pick-axe as a weapon are referred to from a RPG-Gaming aspect or alse as a tool

The Maciejowski Bible show a leaf of Cain killing Able, but looks more of an improvised opportunistic weapon.

[david lewis smith]

I have a small mattox i will post photos of later, it would be a nasty weapon, I also have the normal size one, nasty weapon if one hit one's target but heavy and designed for digging and breaking hard soil and rock, not people.

[dwayne davis]

the flat paralell edge usually has a rough edge to them for cutting through roots. ( i garden) even if it did not i immagen that it would still break bones. i don't see much that the pick part would not go through.a strong person with a two handed swing could force someone to the ground in a hurry. ( i belive)

[Greg]

BIG-TIME necro-post here, but there's merit to re-open the discussion on account of Weta.

Andy was curious about Tolkien's mention of the Mattock, a mining and gardening tool, being used as a weapon by Dwarves. Obviously, being miners, it stands to reason that if you can fight with a mining tool, it'd be handier than carrying both an axe AND your digger for the sake of weight.

But here, amongst the rabble of dwarves Weta has presented us with, many of which have, so far, disappointed, we find ourselves with a straight-up dwarven Mattock:

http://www-images.theonering.org/torwp/ ... esbitt.jpg

Thoughts? I think the war hammer on one side was excellently done, and fits in well with the spade. Looks very nicely dwarven, even if I can't yet wrap my mind around the bomber hat.

[Duathen]

Good eyes - I noticed that too. I really like the design, especially the geometric shaft taper. Maybe in Smaug's horde we'll get a glance at one of the visored helmets too.

Not to go too off topic, but for the hat, based on the rest of the clothing I get the impression that the designers were heavily influenced by Tibetan and Mongolian dress, which explains the hat design. It's definitely on the extreme side, though.

[Ringulf]

BIG-TIME necro-post here, but there's merit to re-open the discussion on account of Weta.

Andy was curious about Tolkien's mention of the Mattock, a mining and gardening tool, being used as a weapon by Dwarves. Obviously, being miners, it stands to reason that if you can fight with a mining tool, it'd be handier than carrying both an axe AND your digger for the sake of weight.

But here, amongst the rabble of dwarves Weta has presented us with, many of which have, so far, disappointed, we find ourselves with a straight-up dwarven Mattock:

http://www-images.theonering.org/torwp/ ... esbitt.jpg

Thoughts? I think the war hammer on one side was excellently done, and fits in well with the spade. Looks very nicely dwarven, even if I can't yet wrap my mind around the bomber hat.

This weapon is not a Mattock but a hammeradze. a mattock has an axe in front or the blade follows the direction of the haft, and the other side the blade is at right angles to the haft. I had one we used to use for stump and root work. it is a helpfull tool and I am sure it could be just as affective as an axe or hammer with the addition that the dwarves would have been quite familiar with it in it's tool form. Just as in history battle axes evolved from the tool form of the wood axe it stands to reason that a mining culture like the Dwarves should have made this a favorite.

By the way have you seen Malox The Shovel of Doom? (just kidding)

[Greg]

I see where you're coming from, but I'm going to stick with calling it a Mattock. For starters, that's the type of tool/weapon Tolkien specifically referred to. Next in line, I've had no luck finding any historical references to a tool called a hammeradze. In fact, the only consistent use of that term I've found anywhere is in the form of a technical ice climbing tool...a rather modern invention by Third Age Standards.

Moving on from there, I've found that there are two main types of Mattocks: Axe/Cutter Mattocks, and Pick Mattocks. The former is comprised of an axelike/wedge blade opposite the adze end, and the latter being a pick opposite the adze end. As such, since we are here for Tolkien accuracy and authenticity as much as anything else, I'm going to assume, within Middle Earth reenactment, that any digging/chopping/heavy use tool placed opposite an adze on a single head can be categorized as a form of Mattock. Hence, I say our newly revealed Dwarf is carrying a Hammer Mattock.

[dwayne davis]

EHH im gonna be an old crumudgen. and say im not entirely in love with this hammeradze, i had envisiond a dwarf armed with a pickmadox. it looks awefully unweildy. i wont comment on the hat?

[Greg]

I agree, Jol. Can't say I'd want to weild one of those. But hey, "Dwarves made light of burdens"...maybe it'd be quicker in the hands of one of them.

[Ringulf]

The Hammeradze is just a compound word description and may have had some other name in period or fantasy. I called it that beacause it is a hammer on the front and an obvious adze in the back.

Pick adze were also quite common depending on the job and these combo heads were developed to have to keep from switching back and forth between two tools during a job that could be done by one.

One thing I am sure of though , is that this is not a mattock, as that is a very specific tool. The ones carried by Dain's warriors from the Iron Hills in the battle of the five armies, were mattocks. They had a vertical and a horizontal cutting edge.

A large hammer or club can certainly be called a "maul" and could be more of what several of the previous posters were thingking of when invisioning the mattock.

[dwayne davis]

perhaps. they are very strong for their size.