Langseax: Axe substitute?

[Chris Russo]

The other night I was running through my Ranger gear in my head, plus the Ranger gear I hope to someday purchase. For a while now I've been lusting after a Paul Binns langseax for my in-woods Ranger sword--because we've all heard Andy's recommendations regarding something about that size.

My thoughts ran like this:
--Seax on left hip
--Axe/hatchet on right hip
--Small camp knife... somewhere. (Maybe as a by-knife on the seax scabbard?)
--Bow in hand
--Quiver on back
--Belt pouch for compass and map
--Over-the-shoulder haversack for fishing gear, nuts and berries, etc.

And this is all before I'm carrying tarp, blanket, cooking gear or food. By now I was feeling rather bogged down, not to mention running out of space on my belt. It began to seem just TOO MUCH to have both seax and axe. I mentioned to my wife in the morning that I thought I wouldn't get the seax after all, and just stick with my axe instead--the axe being both camp tool and melee sidearm.

She said, "Can the langseax do what your axe does?"

That gave me pause. CAN it? An axe is for firewood and kindling as much as for orc necks. Hatchets are perhaps the most versatile of survival tools. I know a langseax is almost like a Norse machete or kuhkri, but is it as versatile? Can a seax fell saplings, split logs, and do all the other camp chores I'd normally demand from my Norse Hawk?

So I'll throw that out to you. What are the capabilities of a langseax--and is it worth getting one to leave the hatchet at home? Can a seax be a hatchet substitute?

[R.D.Metcalf]

I think that would depend on the langseax. Sam Salvati made one that got some play on SFI, that I wouldnt doudt could easily replace a belt axe.

[Greg]

I'd say that it certainly could. I'd prefer a long blade that can function as an axe over an axe that has trouble functioning as a blade, but that's just me. I have a very similar layout:

Short Sword on Left Hip
Kukri (functions as hatchet) attached to quiver behind back
Small Camp Knife strapped to boot via wraps/winningas
Bow in Hand
Quiver on Back

[Willrett]

I love the long seax and would buy on in a heart beat. I have never really looked into them but now cant wait to start.

For now I will carry the below knives and hatchet, my bow with quiver on back and either a sword or long seax when I get one.

I posted pics before the my knife and hatchet combo that I am redoing the handles on and the small horn handle knife. I also plan on redoing the case out of leather with buttons.

[Jon]

I have used both a hatchet and a parang variation- if a parang is enough like a seax, definitely go for the seax.

[kaelln]

Chris, whatever happened to the Cold Steel sax machete you rehilted? I would think that might give you some idea, although how it compares to the blade you want is a legit question.

[Willrett]

I have the same cold steel sax but I got both the 12 and 18. I have used both for clearing paths out of the woods for carrying fire wood and both work really good but I have not really tried to split anything or to cut any small saplings.

I still have to rehilt both of mine and finish the scabbards.

[Eledhwen]

I have them both too..both on the to-do list as regards rehilting and making new sheaths for them.

They are solid enough...not sure about the heft though as they are also fairly lightweight. Part of what makes the belt axe work so well is the mass.

Currently I use one of the trousse knives with the belt axe. A belt pouch and shoulder bag rather like a haversack, and the arrow bag. Light kit; I have not tried taking the pack and all with it but I do not expect it would change the dynamics that much.

Eledhwen

[E.MacKermak]

I learned some years ago (from an old man that teaches a college class on survival) how to split logs with only a 5" blade knife using a stout stick, so a langsax would definitely work for that. As for knocking down saplings, I would think a langsax would work if it is properly made with a thick spine. Not sure I am likely to give up the belt axe just to gain 2 lbs though.

[Willrett]

I kinda like the idea of having both. Once I get to do some treks I will decide for sure. I plan on a few atleast one night trips starting in spring and will try a few different combos.

[Cinead]

I have been thinking a lot about this same exact question.

I have a bearded axe that I made, it is ground from an Iltis OxHead brand axe head. It is top quality. It has a 20" handle. This axe is a perfect fit for what many bushcraft experts feel is the most important tool in the wilds (see Mears, Chochanski, and the like). I can make a small cabin if need be or a one night shelter....and make a ton of fire wood.

I also have a hand forged Scandinavian style seax that I made with the help from a friend. It has a 12" long blade that is 2" wide and 1/4" thick at the spine. Its a big knife. Heavy duty and good in the woods.

But I rarely carry it. I live in the land of the hard woods and belt axes have been used in KY since the first settlers. A long knife, belt axe and clasp knife were the go to tools when men depended on their blades to live!

So, I carry a 10" bladed hand forged dirk, my belt axe and neck knife and NEVER leaves my body and is rarely taken from under my shirt.

While the seax is heavier and a bit longer than my dirk, the dirk is still a great tool for butchering and cutting heavy grass for bedding as well as a heck of a weapon in the thick underbrush of KY. The axe is a tool and a weapon as well. It can keep me warm with wood, build me a shelter as well as take an orc head. Use the bearded axe to hook an arm or shield and shove the dirk in their eye or throat!

If I lived in a scrubby area or the desert....seax for sure but here.....belt axe all the way.

[Jonathan B.]

I learned some years ago (from an old man that teaches a college class on survival) how to split logs with only a 5" blade knife using a stout stick, so a langsax would definitely work for that. As for knocking down saplings, I would think a langsax would work if it is properly made with a thick spine. Not sure I am likely to give up the belt axe just to gain 2 lbs though.

Batoning can be quite useful.But is not an optimal choice.

[Chris Russo]

To answer your question, kaelin--I rehilted that seax as an exploration of this very question. On my last trek I took her out and tried her, with my hatchet as backup. The seax performed adequately in even heavy-duty work like notching logs to break into firewood, though the hatchet performed slightly better. It's beefy enough that it can do jobs like that. And I like that it's a cheap enough blade that I don't mind abusing it so--I'd be hesitant to risk an expensive blade.

So I think the seax can do a whole lot that the hatchet can. I still like having the hatchet/axe handy, but in a two-Ranger team (like, say, me and my wife), one person can carry each.

[Mirimaran]

I think that the question of weight versus use and multi-tasking deserves some more attention. Since Rangers wandered far and wide, presumably for months at a time, they might have only carried the most basic of supplies, and foraged for the rest, but would have to have a minimum of core implements to carry them through, both for fighting and for survival. My ex sis-in-law is an avid hiker and climber, and I know she plans her weight allowances to the ounce sometimes, but figuring that a Ranger of long ago might not be that exact, how do you think he would plan his patrol of, say, 3 months?

Btw, I have not had much chance to use that seax I got from Peter, but from what I have used it for (some light sapling chopping during yard work) it was pretty impressive. I can certainly see carrying that, and doing some selective weight distribution with the apprentice

[Elleth]

For what it's worth, shortly before coming to Alaska I purchased a decently made copy of the "WSK" knife that was so popular some years ago to put in the survival bag for flying. I know it's not a Seax, but the "knife that can chop" idea is the same. While I can't promise to be any kind of wilderness expert or well traveled or anything, given my experience to date with the idea, I'd say -

"A very decent compromise tool for a person who's going into the wilderness that may have an unexpected stop, and so may need to improvise more specialized tools from the woodlands. Not a particularly good solution for a professional woods walker who will already access to an array of specialized tools."

For example - and this is inspired by reading about the hunting and military parties on our old frontier - consider that it was common for gear to be split up. One person might carry a fair sized axe. Another a cooking pot for four. Another a couple extra blankets. That way there was much less need for "compromise equipment," and no one was overburdened.

On the other hand, if you're just half a dozen rangers, it would sure suck to have the guy carrying your cooking pot get nailed by an Orc, and not be able to get him - or the pot.


All of which is the long way of saying - of all the guys I've known who go into the wilderness fairly often, on their lonesome or in small groups, Cinead's triumverate of "hatchet, big knife, little knife" has been almost universal... in modern eras sometimes minus the big knife, and sometimes supplemented with a bear pistol. But "hatchet and little knife" has stuck around for centuries for a reason.

All that said.... ain't no substitute for getting out and trying oneself.