Today I learned a thing...

For discussion of knowledge of the wood; this means camping, tracking, and other outdoor pursuits.

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Greg
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Re: Today I learned a thing...

Post by Greg »

Elleth wrote:Regarding short bows and ease of use... is that because longer limbs have a stabilizing effect, like using a pole on a balance beam? Or because you can anchor more consistently? Both/neither/something else?
Both, and neither. It isn't the length itself that stabilizes, in my experience, so much as the weight and the differences in limb travel distance. Part of what makes compound bows SO STINKING ACCURATE is that their limbs are CRAZY strong (far too strong to be drawn in a traditional configuration), but the cams (wheels) handle the string travel distance so the limbs actually move an incredibly short distance...many of them move less than an inch. Then, when the bow is fired, the shock to the bow and the arm is extremely low because the limbs aren't generating a forward-moving inertia that shakes the whole bow. When you compare that to traditional bows, the shorter the limbs are, the further they have to bend to achieve a similar draw length. A true LONGbow, when we start getting over 70" in length, really doesn't have to bend very far to enable a full draw, so the limbs don't have to travel as far upon release either.

In addition to limb travel, there's the weight. A lightweight bow won't absorb as much of the movement as a heavier one will, and so the arrow has to handle more of that shock (requiring a heavier arrow to avoid a dry-fire scenario that could cause catastrophic delamination or a break). It's like hitting a full-size baseball with a plastic whiffle bat...not a good scenario, though that's an extreme example.

Being able to anchor more consistently without excessive finger pinch is, of course, a huge benefit to longer limbs as well. If the release fingers aren't comfortable, they won't perform well.
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Iodo
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Re: Today I learned a thing...

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Greg wrote: In addition to limb travel, there's the weight. A lightweight bow won't absorb as much of the movement as a heavier one will, and so the arrow has to handle more of that shock (requiring a heavier arrow to avoid a dry-fire scenario that could cause catastrophic delamination or a break). It's like hitting a full-size baseball with a plastic whiffle bat...not a good scenario, though that's an extreme example.
I know this is sort of off topic, but thanks for that explanation, I think I finally understand why re-curve archers at my club cover there risers in pieces of steel and recommend that I should add weights to mine, deliberately making a bow heavier while claiming it improves accuracy has always made no sense to me because surely a heaver bow would be harder to hold still while you shoot

I've just had a eureka moment :P
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Greg
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Re: Today I learned a thing...

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Iodo wrote:
Greg wrote: In addition to limb travel, there's the weight. A lightweight bow won't absorb as much of the movement as a heavier one will, and so the arrow has to handle more of that shock (requiring a heavier arrow to avoid a dry-fire scenario that could cause catastrophic delamination or a break). It's like hitting a full-size baseball with a plastic whiffle bat...not a good scenario, though that's an extreme example.
I know this is sort of off topic, but thanks for that explanation, I think I finally understand why re-curve archers at my club cover there risers in pieces of steel and recommend that I should add weights to mine, deliberately making a bow heavier while claiming it improves accuracy has always made no sense to me because surely a heaver bow would be harder to hold still while you shoot
It also reduces hand shock by the inertia principle...objects at rest will tend to stay at rest, and heavier objects require more force to get them going. So if you're shooting a quite heavy target recurve with a modern ultralight carbon fiber arrow, the force created by the moving arrow will do hardly a thing to the heavy bow, so one can shoot with a very open and loose target grip without fear of the bow flying around...which is what those folks you shoot with are after. The effects are less signifiant with OUR sort of trad bows, because the bows can't be THAT heavy and the arrows can't be THAT light, but the principles are the same!
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Iodo
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Re: Today I learned a thing...

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Greg wrote: It also reduces hand shock by the inertia principle...objects at rest will tend to stay at rest, and heavier objects require more force to get them going. So if you're shooting a quite heavy target recurve with a modern ultralight carbon fiber arrow, the force created by the moving arrow will do hardly a thing to the heavy bow, so one can shoot with a very open and loose target grip without fear of the bow flying around...which is what those folks you shoot with are after. The effects are less signifiant with OUR sort of trad bows, because the bows can't be THAT heavy and the arrows can't be THAT light, but the principles are the same!
interesting, thanks :P

I do shoot with a modern bow with a metal riser so in theory, this should be the same for me as it is for them, but because I choose a traditional style of archery (and not to add gadgets to my bow) I end up using traditional methods to aim and shoot and getting much better accuracy that way, as you say: the principles are the same! :mrgreen:
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Manveruon
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Re: Today I learned a thing...

Post by Manveruon »

That was an absolutely fantastic explanation! Thanks Greg!
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